taratata Posted June 13, 2004 Share Posted June 13, 2004 ME: Pirating currently available games is wrong, but what on Earth is wrong with taking an academic interest in gamecube emulation, as a matter of technical curiosity?only because that information can be easily corrupted. show a person how to make dynamite. i truely doubt they will ONLY, then, use it in a constructive sense. for example, industrial mining and what have you. with emulating a system that has been abandoned and/or taken off the market, well, you can then really do no harm. doing the same with a system that is currently being sold and what not, well, you already know my answer to that. If I push further your thought: do not teach programming because you could write emus with it. Don't teach iron forging, because you could make knifes and guns with it. Don't teach stone carving, because you could do sharp pieces that could be used as weapons.That's it! You're in the before-stone-age paradize About how emus for recent systems are a steal... if you would have bought the console, maybe. If not, I don't see much change for the company. And seeing how emus for current systems go (4 fps?), anyone who wants to play decently a GC game and who can afford it will buy a GC. Those who can't are screwed anyway. I have a shitload of mp3s and the number of cds I've bought each year has not gone down. Have I stolen anyone? If so, who? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadow K Posted June 14, 2004 Share Posted June 14, 2004 Ouch good point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ME! Posted June 16, 2004 Share Posted June 16, 2004 ME: Pirating currently available games is wrong, but what on Earth is wrong with taking an academic interest in gamecube emulation, as a matter of technical curiosity?only because that information can be easily corrupted. show a person how to make dynamite. i truely doubt they will ONLY, then, use it in a constructive sense. for example, industrial mining and what have you. with emulating a system that has been abandoned and/or taken off the market, well, you can then really do no harm. doing the same with a system that is currently being sold and what not, well, you already know my answer to that. If I push further your thought: do not teach programming because you could write emus with it. Don't teach iron forging, because you could make knifes and guns with it. Don't teach stone carving, because you could do sharp pieces that could be used as weapons.That's it! You're in the before-stone-age paradize About how emus for recent systems are a steal... if you would have bought the console, maybe. If not, I don't see much change for the company. And seeing how emus for current systems go (4 fps?), anyone who wants to play decently a GC game and who can afford it will buy a GC. Those who can't are screwed anyway. I have a shitload of mp3s and the number of cds I've bought each year has not gone down. Have I stolen anyone? If so, who?its weighting the bad with the good. people are only interested in what they believe they can do, and never stop to think if they should, infact, do it. though, people back then were of limited intelligence and didnt know any better. when they came up with stone carving and iron forging, they did it only because they saw it as a means of survival. they only saw the potential for a positive effect, and most likely, had no idea it would have a negative impact on thier lives aswell. im sorry, but, the same can not be said about emulating gamecube games. as of now, its emulation would only have a negative effect, except for the person pirating the game, but, thats just like any other form of theivery. give it ten years or so from now, when the games are not available in retail stores. only then will i see a positive outcome to it all. not all emus run thier games at 4 fps. some games can be run at a good frame rate, at the sametime, maybe having some graphics trouble. others can be run at a not so good frame rate, and at the sametime, having great graphics. then there are the games, which are the exception, that run at a decent fps and with decent graphics. obviously, i dont have first-hand experiance running gamecube emus. i can only say i get my info from screenshots, articles, and from people whom i know, that have seen them run for themselves. the emulation of these present day consoles is getting better and better, very quickly. i give it a year or three before they start doing there job almost perfectly. that may seem like a long enough time for the games to have been out, to justify their emulation, but consider this. all next-gen consoles will be backwards compatable with their present day counterparts. it is then safe to assume, that most, if not all, games that are out now, will still be available to purchase then. it would be silly for them not to be. furthermore, we are not only speaking of gamecube emulation, but, xbox, ps2 and newly released arcade games aswell. oh, and about the amount of cds you buy, versus the amount of mp3s you download... everyone and thier mother that downloads mp3s to dvd rips claims that. i dont believe it for a second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ovalprocess Posted June 18, 2004 Share Posted June 18, 2004 but, ive already got a GC... why would i spend the money on a second one?well, thats a good question. being that most people who are intrested in gamecube emulation, dont actually own one, i assumed you didnt either. on a personal note, i detest gamecube emulation, aswell as ps2, and xbox. infact, its not emulation, its theivery. thats why i advised you to buy one. now, the fact that you DO own one, and are still intrested in its emulation, is not much better. although, thats your prerogative. i for one love nintendo, and dont want to see it one day destroyed, due to such acts. i dont mean to flame you, thats just my reasoning for my previous statement. all emulation is technically stealing. you can't measure theft in degrees. im not. emulation was created for preservation purposes. what emulation "has become" during the past several years, is beside the point. here's an example of my logic... emulating old atari games that no one is presently making money off of, meaning the developers. GOOD! emulating newly released gamecube, ps2, xbox, arcade games etc, which developers are still making money from. BAD! what good is owning the rights to a title, if its just gonna sit there on a shelf collecting dust for a decade or two. that's why emulation was created, and that's the only reason why i am involved in it. youre not thinking the same way that a corporation thinks. corporations get the laws made, and when you get right down to it, thats where our "right and wrong" comes from. environmentalists want to preserve the earth so that future generations can enjoy it, yet the govt and corporations want to rape the land for everything its worth. when the hippies chain themselves to trees in the path of the bulldozers, who's going to get arrested? the people with nothing but everyones best interest in mind, or the people with the power and the cash? even i myself wear an eyepatch and a pegleg, but i dont try to convince myself that what im doing is "right". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gavin19 Posted June 21, 2004 Share Posted June 21, 2004 I never actually stopped to think if emulation itself was 'wrong'. When I first heard that I could happpily run any of my old Master System, GB, MegaDrive and/or SNES games for free I was amazed and intrigued. Inevitably I set about d/ling any old games I used to own plus a few others out of nostalgia more than anything else. Soon it became apparent that these old games were old in more than just a graphical sense. Very, very few of my old SNES games I would still consider worth playing today.I then started to progress towards more modern games/systems such as NeoGeo, N64 plus any CPS1/2 games I could find. I played around with these for a bit longer but I came to more or less the same conclusion - in terms of the total games package they don't really measure up by today's standards.So I thought, which modern systems can be capably emulated yet still have games regularly released? GBA immediately came to mind. That is now my system of choice for downloading roms etc however I never questioned the morality of doing so.It seems to me that theres two general types of Emu fans. Those who place preservation of roms foremost and generally only use outdated systems. Or those who would emulate anything there PC could handle. I can see both sides and obviously would like every old game to be preserved but I would also like to see more modern emulation too. My reason for this is that although I have owned a GBA for 2yrs or so I only ever bought one game for it (Mario Kart) and it has lay gathering dust since. So I am not depriving any developer etc of profit by using Virtual Boy to play the latest games because I decided long ago that I would not be purchasing any more GBA games.As for next-gen emulation it is still, as was said, a few years from perfection so I can hardly see people trading their GCs or whatever for some choppy emulation, so I don't buy the thievery ideal.Also GC is different because copied games cannot be directly played and so the piracy side of things is virtually non-existant. Also it has been shown that not all ripped games work on PCs and certainly few that do work could be considered 100% perfect.As for PS2/XBOX emulation, as has been mentioned that is years away from perfection and if people have no qualms about playing emulated xbox games then they would certainly not hesitate to play pirated discs on their 'chipped' boxes. So why would they bother with crappy next-gen emu when they can buy 100% working copies for pennies/cents??So for me emulation of consoles was 99% nostalgia trip and I have hardly touched any of those games since, but as they r no longer comercially profiting anyone then it has been agreed that this is mostly harmless. However I'm sure that there are people who actively use emulators to by-pass having to purchase new consoles/games and it is this that I do not agree with.That was at once rambling/off-topic/contradictory but it was also my honest opinion. Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agozer Posted June 21, 2004 Share Posted June 21, 2004 I wholeheartedly agree with everything you've said, G19.I'm one of those who generally do not care emulating the next-gen systems. Emulation should be all about preserving older games and taking that trip down Memory Lane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taratata Posted June 23, 2004 Share Posted June 23, 2004 Sorry, I was away for a few days so I couldn't answer. Anyway, G19 has said it all. I'll just answer about that cd stuff.oh, and about the amount of cds you buy, versus the amount of mp3s you download... everyone and thier mother that downloads mp3s to dvd rips claims that. i dont believe it for a second.Sure, people who had the money to buy lots of cds buy less of them now. I could only afford one or two per year, and had to listen to crappy radio music or copies of copy of copy of audio cassettes that friends gave me.The difference between now and before is that I never buy cds from mainstream artists anymore. They sell lots of crappy (for the biggest part) cds because of ads. And I don't buy the "mp3s have killed the music industry" argument. First, it is still very wealthy. Second, cds are way too expensive. And third, it has gotten harder and harder for beginning artists to get produced: they're not enough income producing from the industry's point of view.I see the music industry the same way as scientific periodics: they were useful to distribute information (music or science) but they have abused so much from that that they only deserve to disappear, now that there are other means to get that information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsukiyo Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Dolwin doesn't work great, i tried playing naruto on it and it onlys plays the opening scene then it stops running the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SQrL Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 its "funny" how most of this thread has nothing to do with it's Subject.pffffffft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsukiyo Posted August 22, 2004 Share Posted August 22, 2004 I just want to say bump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daeval Posted August 22, 2004 Share Posted August 22, 2004 (edited) My reason for this is that although I have owned a GBA for 2yrs or so I only ever bought one game for it (Mario Kart) and it has lay gathering dust since. So I am not depriving any developer etc of profit by using Virtual Boy to play the latest games because I decided long ago that I would not be purchasing any more GBA games.I don't think I really need to say anything here, but I will.. This is some of the WORST logic I have ever seen in my life. A sarcastic counter-example: A fresh apple in the market costs 50 cents. You decide that you don't want to spend your money on an apple. So, you take one off the cart and walk away eating it. Obviously you're not hurting the farmer because you weren't going to buy the apple anyway. When you buy "Things" you earn yourself the right to enjoy them. It's an exchange, the very basis of an honest economy. When you decide not to buy something, you are deciding to go without the "Thing" in exchange for keeping whatever the "Compensation" would have been. This is not what you are doing. What you are doing is getting the "Thing" AND keeping the "Compensation." This is called Stealing and, aside from the technical term, is harmful to the farmer AND the video game developer; the people who work hard to make the things you enjoy. However I'm sure that there are people who actively use emulators to by-pass having to purchase new consoles/games and it is this that I do not agree with.You may not agree with it, but it is exactly what you're doing. Edited August 23, 2004 by Daeval Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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