Riot.EXE

...My next question is for RPG's... ...What, do you think, makes the RPG experience better for the player? The story, the battle system, or the cutscenes?

Ok...guess I should add my own 2 cents into my own damn topic...'fore I do, let me state that I am not biased towards either dimension... The 2-D standpoint ...When it comes to the potential of 2-D fighters, its all about the fluidity in moves and creativity in character design for one...There's a bit of a limit to this since its on a flat plane, which means you'd have to draw everything in yourself (with MK 1-3 and the wannabes after being the exception) and drawing the same character over and over and over for a moveset is time consuming...which explains why there's head swaps (Ryu & Friends being the prime example)...because there's deadlines to make, so there isn't always time to create fully original characters. As for the creativity issue, its also hard to incorporate certain types of designs onto the characters, such as readable text. the only character that was able to pull off such a thing was Dee Jay, but that was because his pants had symmetrical letters written vertically, so it wouldn't look any different when he faced either direction (thanks to EVERY 2-D developers bad habit of just flipping the sprites rather than realistically having them properly positioned when the sides reverse), but had the "MAXIMUM" been written horizontally, it would have caused a problem, thanks to the lazy tactic I mentioned. Another flaw in the visuals is shadowing, if you notice in some 2-D fighters (mainly anything Streetfighter), characters don't have real shadows, just circles or hearts of some sort (SF2). Thats inexcusable because other companies have been able to pull off realistic shadows, and more (look at KoF 1996, in the Korean Teams Stage, the water caused by the flooding actually showed your reflection). and then there's the lack of upgrading sprites for crossover games and the such, mainly the CVS series...because most of the Capcom side didn't get visually upgraded, the end result became quite ugly when watching some matches (such as...anything with morrigan)... ...There are actually some pros to these flaws...mainly that it allows for faster gameplay in some cases. and more data saved for other things (such as more detailed backgrounds...), but one of the main reasons why people don't like 2-D anymore is because of laziness in design... ...Now for the actual fighting. There's also a flaw thanks to designing in the 2-D plane...because of the hand drawing issue, it also means that creating various moves will become more tedious, so each character has only but so many moves...so there isn't much to see in terms of a characters arsenal of moves...(hence why we look for glitches and such...Guiles handcuffs anyone?) and with that lack of moves, its easier to get bored with the 2-D fighters, should you not be willing enough to gain some real skill in them to at least put up a good fight. The main thing here is for the developers to create more innovative fighting systems for use on the 2-D plane...but all these flaws can be fixed as long as developers are provided with this one thing... ...TIME...Developers need to take more time to look into these flaws in designing 2-D fighters...as long as they have that, the new generation of 2-D fighters will become more fun and furious to play. Also, so called "fans" need to stop being so impatient with developers...Making games at all take a lot of hard work... The 3-D Standpoint ...I personally feel that 3-D games allow for more innovation-with-ease in terms of design, simply because the technology is different, and the inclusion of the Z-Axis. Thanks to that magic axis, developers can work better in creating innovative character designs and moves, due to the ease in art transferring (through skins) and motion capturing and posing (for realistic and non-realistic fighting styles). What makes this ease such a great thing, is when it comes to upgrading the characters through sequels, all that needs to be done is to update the skins and models for the characters, rather than having to re-draw everything from scratch as you would have to do in a 2-D fighter sequel. This allows the developers more time to create new characters and new moves for the previous characters...Unfortunately, this can also create a ton of laziness (see Tobal 2's quest mode characters, or the Jacks and Eddie/Tiger/Christie in the Tekken series...or Battle Arena Tochinden 3)...which can also diminish the players from wanting to play them...people like originality more than repetition (at least...I HOPE so...) ...In terms of actually fighting...3-D games have more of an opporitunity to have more innovative fighting engines, such as interacting with backgrounds and the such. (not to say that 2-D fighters couldn't pull something like that off, but I feel that it would be a hell of a lot harder to do...) So with that, 3-D can create much more interesting fight scenarios, with the right set of creative minds behind them... ...While there aren't as many flaws (in my opinion) towards creating 3-D fighters, they're still very apparent...but can be fixed with the same answer, and that is more time to develop more great ideas in design and engines... End Scene...

...Here's my question to you all... "What dimension has the better potential for fighting games (2d or 3d) and why do you think it?" have at it kids!

...Kingdom Hearts is beating Soul Calibur on Gamefaqs.com for their "Best Game. Ever" contest...there's no way in Fizzneeucking hell Kingdom Hearts should win this round...

It's $5.15/H It's 6.75 over here in cali. It all depends on the state...different costs of living ahd sh--t...

well...yeah...but when it comes to a 6 face button arcade-ish layout, capcom comes to mind...hence my mentioning it...it was meant as an example...

Thats true...especially with DoA 1 and that stupid exploding ring out sh--t...

In VF, those I've played against that BM'ed could win because blocking them scooted me back...and sometimes I got a ring out...but when I got better, I could counter them...Skilled players put up good fights and the opponents in Quest mode were claimed to have been based off of actual pro VF players... ...forgot I said that didn't you...geez...I was talking about since VF1 and onward...the whole series...not just the one game...of course I sidestep and sh--t now...god damn...

Actually, DoA is the most BMF I can think of...Tekken is the least, (in terms of quality series...) but as it was said, has the most BMF character in the Eddy/Christie movesets... VF is somewhere in the middle...you can be very BM in it...or, be skilled like mad crazy...whereas in DoA, you had to press Free at the right time or else BM's were all over your ass...and Tekken's main dillema was in juggling...you need very little to be cheap... then again...can you really compare the fighting in Tekken to Doa or VF? Tekken allowed a button for each limb, whereas VF and DoA simply had a punch and a kick...that DOES account for a different style of play...then again...we could bring up Beastorizer/Bloody Roar series... Riot I respect your opinions but mate I don't understand where the f@ck your getting your facts from.... Tekken and DOA are the biggest button mashers I have ever played...damn I even saw a 10 year old beat a teenager by just pressing all of the buttons at the same time... Some of the characters in VF4 are prone to button mashing but to pull of the moves and actually win requires skillz. If you play against someone with skillz they will be able to kick the button mashers ass without any effort.... I'm getting these facts from everyone I've ever played against, and all the fights I've watched in the three games... When I played DoA with people...most Button mashed, when they didn't realize that timing was very important in pulling out certain combos, but the Free button timing is also a bit strange...so if you screw up...you get BM'ed...because in order to block, you have to HOLD the free button...and after the free animation, it goes into the block... In Tekken, everyone I, or a friend, played against that BM'ed was dispatched of with the sidestep moves and parrying (given the proper character)...but Skilled people either played fair, or juggled you like crazy (Julia in Tekken Tag...geez...) Plus, since the button layout was different than VF or DoA (individual limbs rather than one punch and one kick) button mashing worked a bit differently...but was much easier to get around... In VF, those I've played against that BM'ed could win because blocking them scooted me back...and sometimes I got a ring out...but when I got better, I could counter them...Skilled players put up good fights and the opponents in Quest mode were claimed to have been based off of actual pro VF players...

The system was able to play all our favorite VS. games (i.e. Marvel vs Capcom) along with the 4mb expansion. Only if Capcom coulda made VS.(or even other streetfighter games like EX) installments on the N64, we wouldnt of had the horrible massacrings we saw on PS1 . Exactly...Kinda like Sega of America not allowing the expansion carted games here...like KoF '95 and pretty much Every CPS2 fighter (thank goodness for Emulators!)

At least none of them are pulling an Elioth with a character that all you can do is button mash and _actually_ get moves out of *coughan-hellcough* True Elioth's games are usually unbalanced, which means some characters have advantages over the rest.... Hahaha...Angel is fun to play with if you know what you're doing...but thats true...she is Quite BMF for the 2d world...

Actually, DoA is the most BMF I can think of...Tekken is the least, (in terms of quality series...) but as it was said, has the most BMF character in the Eddy/Christie movesets... VF is somewhere in the middle...you can be very BM in it...or, be skilled like mad crazy...whereas in DoA, you had to press Free at the right time or else BM's were all over your ass...and Tekken's main dillema was in juggling...you need very little to be cheap... then again...can you really compare the fighting in Tekken to Doa or VF? Tekken allowed a button for each limb, whereas VF and DoA simply had a punch and a kick...that DOES account for a different style of play...then again...we could bring up Beastorizer/Bloody Roar series...

What does that mean? WT Flock was that thing in SC then? Doesnt that train you for something? Is fighting with a staff and fighting with a sword the same style? At least in SC2 you weren't air juggled, well not forever anyways(ring outs). I mean Playing styles, not fighting styles...you know...like what to do with people who turtle a lot, or the ultra offensive people, one who uses a lot of kicks...sh--t like that...you fight all different kinds of arcade play styles, that you actually get the sense you've gotten better... ...think about other fighters...Street fighter anything...you can always expect Ken to do that stupid light-to-heavy-shoryuken thing, and chun-li to block all the time...Dead or Alive...you can always expect Hyabusa to do that thing where he theows you in the air, leaf teleports, and izuna bombs you while yelling "HO!" like Lion-O...I could name other patterns in other fighters...but then I'd just bore you...but I hope you get what I meant now...

Riot.exe are you serious??? I remember just pressing punch in Tekken all the time and pulling off like a 10 hit combo...now if you don't call that a button masher then there is something wrong with you....I tried that exact same stunt with VF4 and could only pull off a 2 hit combo.... Please guys actually play VF4 using some of the harder characters such as Akira and then post back here about wether you still think its a button masher Chill out..I'm not saying you can't button mash in tekken...but its not as easy to get away with it in that series, than it is in VF or DoA...

personally...I think nintendo's main problem is that they're way too first party for their own good...no one wants to really work for them 'cause its either their way or the highway...'specially in america... ...look back to nes...in japan, developers were allowed to make their own chips and crap to make their games better, but when those games were brought to america, they had to be downgraded because american nes's only worked on one kind of chip...compare the japanese and american versions of Castlevania 3 for the best example of this... ...Super NES...could have had something great...but nintendo said screw that, and now we have Playstation... ...Gameboy...the biggest "F--ck you" to the gaming industry ever...no one thought it would ever succeed because it lacked color...look at where it is now, then look at where the other handhelds are...DEAD...the problem with this is the backwards compatability with certain things...Nintendo Dissed itself when pokemon crystal came out...wasn't backwards compatible for gameboy, which meant no super gameboy support either, despite it being in the same era as gold and silver...also, game boy color made regular game boy games kinda "eh"...but the super game boy activated ones (again with the pokemon) didn't get those perks...and now Gameboy Player on gamecube does the same crap...no super gameboy activation...obviously they forgot something... ...Virtual boy...came out in the era of horrid consoles, and in itself was quite horrid (only video game anything to f--ck with my health)...and was just a hassle to play... ...N64...They did not want to go CD yet...and because of that, many developers didn't want to work with them (and the controller had a good layout for fighting games too...imagine what Capcom could have done...) they should have learned from their mistake with SNES's supposed add on cost them... ...Gamecube...too first party for its own good...just look at that abomination of a controller...my GOD...its not really all that friendly for anything but nintendo's own games...BAD IDEA...and why allow PSO and sh--t to be on it if you're not gonna have a keyboard? ...thats all for now...

Well...I picked up VF4: Evolution as soon as I saw it...the best thing I can say about it, is playing alone doesn't get dull like in pretty much ALL fighters (that don't have survival mode)...Quest mode alone practically trains you for arcade playing...no other fighter I know of does that...you fight all kinds of different styles in there...it just truly prepares you for humans...and it was consistent in updating graphics...very nice...and The music isn't all that bad, I perfer the Event Square tracks myself... ...on the flipside...In terms of stages...its a step backwards from VF3 (the only other VF, aside from VF Kids, I never played)...I recall the stages in 3 to have more life to them, and weren't just caged in squares...also...VF never really had that much of a story to follow (all I know is Lau is Pai's dad, and Sarah is Jacky's sister)...and no story = dull...and I don't know about you all...but Kage has got to be the most boring ninja ever...I didn't think that was even possible...and there's that one other problem...despite the depth it actually has, VF was always a bit too button masher friendly...only 3d game that wasn't really BMF was Tekken...but thats a whole 'nother story... ...well...there's my contribution to this post...

...sounds like fun... ...I get on Kaillera with my Kawaks (I have 1.49) amd Gens 2.11...but its gonna have to wait until I get to chicago...then I'll let you all know when I'm comin' into the carnage...

Notice how as KoF went on...Yuri became more and more Shotokan influenced...I mean...Look at her in KoF '03...the transformation is complete... In part due to SNK's attempt at mocking Ryu. Payback for Dan I guess. Yeah...Still too many Kyokugen Karate/Shokouken characters. Lucky for SNK though...there's actually a visible story as to why the Art of Fighting Team (excluding Kings entry into that team in 2000) fights the same way with few differences...

Notice how as KoF went on...Yuri became more and more Shotokan influenced...I mean...Look at her in KoF '03...the transformation is complete...

I doubt it since they already have 2 Kyoguken (sp?) fighters and I doubt they would add a third one who in all intents and purposes is the same as Ryo. But it would be cool to see Robert. Kyokugen Karate

Keep in mind that the japanese voice actor for Tetsuo (whom K9999 was an homage to) also played the voice to K9999 (which is pronounced K-4-9, in case you didn't know) I also heard that the person who does Kyo's voice is the person who does the voice of Kaneda I wouldn't know...never saw Akira in its natural language...just the 2 dubs of it in english... Speakin' of Kyo...Hayato's MVC2 vocals are damn near EXACTLY like Kyo...listen to some of his lines when he does his moves...

...actually it was a side company called Arika who was responsible for SF:EX...I don't really get where Takara comes in...I guess its because I only actually played the first one...

Keep in mind that the japanese voice actor for Tetsuo (whom K9999 was an homage to) also played the voice to K9999 (which is pronounced K-4-9, in case you didn't know)

eminem is a good rapper?!?!?!? ...good enough to get by I guess...I don't have much of a problem...but I like El-P a lot more...listen to some of his stuff...

ouch...friggin' ouch... oh man Riot it was so sad to see 60 year old punk rockers getting paid to suck Then I'm more than glad I didn't have to see it...