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SNK is too lazy!!!!!

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#34
Diso

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Capcom made too many games to count even the incredible Chaos Legion. So they got the 3d market better than SNK :)

#35
Agozer

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Capcom made too many games to count even the incredible Chaos Legion. So they got the 3d market better than SNK :)

Chaos Legion isn't that incredible...Oh well, opinions, opinions.... :lol:

#36
Diso

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Yes but they're doing something else.
Capcom isn't all about street fighter. They HAVE made Resident Evil especially Outbreak.
Snk needs to get something going :lol:
Maybe a Metal Slug Online o_O :)

#37
Spiffy

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yeah ur ryt! i 4got they made my fave rpg games, as well breath of fire series..

#38
Carnicero

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Capcom made too many games to count even the incredible Chaos Legion. So they got the 3d market better than SNK :)

I thought we were just talking 2D fighters. Aside from those, Capcom is a goliath. They've published a mountain of arcade titles and still squeeze out almost enough console titles to compete with Electronic Arts. But they definitely are not what they used to be. Resident Evil is waning, Megaman is a tailspinning franchise, even the Breath of Fire games are not in the same category as the original two. They could be doing better. Same for Konami, who seem to ride off Metal Gear and put minimal effort into the other titles. There hasn't been a decent Contra game since Metal Slug stole the crown.

#39
winchie303

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SNK Playmore is getting to lazy!!!

I'm a big SNK fan and own a few classic titles, but ever since Playmore bought SNK rights. Their game got very sloppy. Compare the awesome Metal Slug 1,2,X and 3 to Metal Slug 4 and 5. It seems like a lot of there games are emulated. I haven't seen creativity in there game.
A good example is that they killed Samarai Shodwon. Look at Samarai Shodown 0 as an example. One motion super move, what happen to the combo system. What happen to the good old days when programers took there time. I haven't seen KOF2003 yet, but hopefully it changes.

Give youir opion!

#40
random guy

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Again, COLOR CHANGES are not the same as COMPLETE REDRAWS. So Ryu's headband or hair changing colors is different than Takuma getting a NEW FACE. Even a new face requires more effort than changing a pallette.

Well, after all these well-argued posts, I don't know where I stand on the debate. But on the above matter, I'd just like to point out that both Capcom and SNK have limitations to work with with character redesigns - notably, that the characters still have to LOOK like themselves. AND most of them have trademark characteristics that MUST be adhered to.

Look at Ken from street fighter. He has blonde/red, long hair and his trademark outfit is a red gi. You could change these things but those are the
things that make him Ken. So what is left to change?

#41
taratata

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Again, COLOR CHANGES are not the same as COMPLETE REDRAWS. So Ryu's headband or hair changing colors is different than Takuma getting a NEW FACE. Even a new face requires more effort than changing a pallette.

Well, after all these well-argued posts, I don't know where I stand on the debate. But on the above matter, I'd just like to point out that both Capcom and SNK have limitations to work with with character redesigns - notably, that the characters still have to LOOK like themselves. AND most of them have trademark characteristics that MUST be adhered to.

Look at Ken from street fighter. He has blonde/red, long hair and his trademark outfit is a red gi. You could change these things but those are the
things that make him Ken. So what is left to change?

I think I get your point.
However, there is much room for changes. I'll take what I think is a good exemple: Terry Bogard.
If you compare the Fatal Fury 1 version and the KOF2002 one, they have the same style, same dressing, and most of the same special moves (although some have been added). But the KOF2002 one has a much much better look. So what did they change? They kept the same character, but changed the sprites. If you compare a child's drawing representing a woman and Leonardo da Vinci's Mona Lisa, both represent (mostly) the same thing, but one looks much better than the other :D
So they redrew the sprites to make them look better, they rethought the design of the special moves, and so on. They must also have added frames to have a better animation.

But redrawn characters don't have to have exactly the same style after the redraw. Take Terry in Garou: MOTW. He doesn't have his red cap and jacket anymore and has now "hair in the wind" :P
But he still has his special moves, and everyone recognises him.

So redraws can be original, and don't have to be only sprites smoothing.

By the way, they have to be careful when playing around with the palette. Characters from CTHD2003 look like they come straight from a 70s disco nghtclub :unsure:

#42
Agozer

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By the way, they have to be careful when playing around with the palette. Characters from CTHD2003 look like they come straight from a 70s disco nghtclub  :P

I've noticed that too. I root for a complete redraw of the sprites (preserving the original design to some degree). Opting for just a palette change sucks big things.

Edited by Agozer, 24 January 2004 - 07:08 PM.


#43
maninderb

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Again, COLOR CHANGES are not the same as COMPLETE REDRAWS. So Ryu's headband or hair changing colors is different than Takuma getting a NEW FACE. Even a new face requires more effort than changing a pallette. It's not the same as drawing new art. Use the color editor in CVS and you'll see how pallettes work. You've got a few swatches of indexed color ranging from 0 to 255 (divided by 8 to get 0-31, or 32 levels). Capcom making Ryu's headband red is a matter of opening up the default pallette and setting the headband's range to 255,0,0. While SNK giving Kyo the white coat requires more than just a simple pallette change.

Everyone's been raising some good points though. I think Capcom and SNK are probably even after the years when it comes to graphical upgrades. I no longer think either side is lazy, they just did things differently. SNK is sure to take the lead though. Future SNK games are on totally new hardware, and Capcom has only Sammy vs. Capcom on the drawing board. So Capcom may lose the graphics battle just because they are failing to keep their fighting games current. They need to light a fire under their asses and redo Darkstalkers as the perfect opportunity to get back in the game on their own without having to lean on another fighting game maker's shoulder. SNK and Sammy are doing great on their own. If not a new Darkstalkers game, Capcom should put out Marvel Vs. Capcom 3 instead of riding coat SNK or Sammy's tails.

As you mentioned the pallette swap and the other stuff, you fail to realize that Capcom has a different style of drawing sprites. If they make ryu's headband totally red, well, its the way it is because of their style of drawing sprites. It's not cuz they're lazy as hell. I agree SNK adds more detail, but their sprites look more sluggish and non-catchy to the eye. SNK tries to mix realism with anime. If you see crazy looking cartoonish sprites, and insane looking massive Hadokens, of course you would want to play the certain game. I've seen screenshots of Marvel vs. Capcom 3. It's really cool. Its like the old MVC, and MVC2, I only saw one screenshot and didn't find the release date. It was a picture of Thor. Hold on.....I'll try to find it again.........







Never mind, they're fake. :(

Edited by maninderb, 26 January 2004 - 07:22 PM.


#44
Carnicero

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Yeah, MVC3 shots are all fake. It's a bummer too, because the initial ones (when everyone thought they were real) featured Marvel's Ghost Rider and Capcom's Dante.




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